It gets even worse

[OryHara]

Watch from around 2mins onward. The reports question is an excellent one. And obviously stupid Bush doesn't understand the question and so takes it on his own tangent.

9min onward is quiet an interesting statement too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag3QsL2hbXI

He believes that others should be tortured for their actions, but not him, and his dog soldiers. Thats bad. Real bad. It just proves what kind of a terrorist Bush is.

 

He was RUDE to those reporters on top of that.

[OryHara]

Okay, first off, explain to me how you know the Government is tapping YOUR VOIP LINE! You seem to have this utmost ignorance and ego to believe that the United States Government, of all organizations, seem to want to specifically tap YOUR LINE! Your line may be included in the broad wiretapping statement, but does that mean that the US is going to necessarily tap your line? No! It doesn't have near the resources to do that.

You said earlier it was to stop 'terrorists'. And that AT&T was in their legal right to do so. And it is in the name of 'National Security'.

 

Therefore, the broad wiretapping is used to intercept a communication signal from one terrorist to another. It may be something simple, like mentioning of certain things, ideas, etc, that might spark enough interest to create a followup tap. If, in that tapping, the US finds enough evidence to believe that a terrorist plot is in the mix, then they will take action and arrest those responsible. Sounds pretty simple to me.

So ideas are illegal now? it sounds like something out of an orsen wells book, or something from one of the scifi novels back in the 50s where societies are ruled by a dictatorship. Do you favor dictatorship? because thats whats going on. If you want to give up your rights go to another country that will support you, and your ideas. Most people here don't. Here it is a democracy. And your opinion is overruled.

 

You believe it is illegal for me to pick up the phone and say that a revolution is at hand and Bush will be overthrown? You believe that it is illegal for me to say that god swatted the U.S. with 9/11 and Katrina to say wake the hell up, and get your act together... OR ELSE..?

 

Maybe I should start a wiretapping program, and run some of my fiber into the homes of republicans, and the homes of the republican majority in the senate, congress, and the white house. That way I can tell if they are planning to overthrow the people, and commit illegal acts on U.S. citizens, like TESTING WEAPONS on them, and illegal cooperation with F500, such as acts of facism. Then I can claim it is to stop the Ji hadist republican extremists... or whatever. How would you like THOSE apples? You wouldn't like that {censored} very much would you?

 

Reasons for not going through a judge is primarily because the information is time sensitive. If we had to wait x amount of hours for a warrant to go through, then there is a strong possibility that an act would be performed BEFORE the time was allotted. Plus, court records are public, and when a warrant is applied for, it would be fairly simple for a terrorist to find out, and then simply cease all forms of current communication.

This coming from the guy who just tried to argue civil liberties with me, the entire basis of the left wing party. All you left wingers are starting to sound like hypocrites to me...

This way, I don't have to wait on my results. I can just listen to words like "Bush Jihad", or "Bomb the Democrats", or "Rig the election", or "Diebold", or "Use Microsoft", or "Enforce the DMCA". That way, I will know a terrorist act WILL be committed.

 

If you don't favor civil liberties, then don't. But don't make the rest of the public suffer because of your stupid propagandist ideas.

 

Thats really stupid. I never said I was 'left winged'.

After all.... If Bush has nothing to hide, then he, congress, the senate, and the republican extremists shouldn't mind their conversations being tapped.

[rollcage]

Reasons for not going through a judge is primarily because the information is time sensitive. If we had to wait x amount of hours for a warrant to go through, then there is a strong possibility that an act would be performed BEFORE the time was allotted. Plus, court records are public, and when a warrant is applied for, it would be fairly simple for a terrorist to find out, and then simply cease all forms of current communication.

 

it really doesn't take long for authorities to get a warrant, usually in a couple minutes. As for the records being public, then keep those ones private, but I still don't want the government going unchecked in its wiretapping policy.

 

I'm all for keeping our country safe, but I don't want out rights and freedoms to be demolished in the process. The terrorists are attacking us because they hate those freedoms, if we destroy them ourselves then they have really won. I just wonder what the limit is, where do we say that the possible added safety isn't worth the freedoms and rights that we give up?

[wildcat69410]

So ideas are illegal now? it sounds like something out of an orsen wells book, or something from one of the scifi novels back in the 50s where societies are ruled by a dictatorship. Do you favor dictatorship? because thats whats going on. If you want to give up your rights go to another country that will support you, and your ideas. Most people here don't. Here it is a democracy. And your opinion is overruled.

 

Who said ideas are illegal? It's not like the NSA is making arrests every day based on simple statements! The Government takes time to look into serious threat possibilities, and then to mark off the ones that are idiots like yourself. I am in no way favoring a dictatorship here, but there is a far cry between a dictatorship and the current American Government. Actually, we're not really a pure democracy, if you actually understand your different forms of government well.

 

You believe it is illegal for me to pick up the phone and say that a revolution is at hand and Bush will be overthrown? You believe that it is illegal for me to say that god swatted the U.S. with 9/11 and Katrina to say wake the hell up, and get your act together... OR ELSE..?

 

Uhm, who said that that is what the wiretaps are for? You seem to be taking some weird random statements, and somehow stringing them together semi-coherently. Actually, that seems to be the theme of a majority of your posts.

 

Maybe I should start a wiretapping program, and run some of my fiber into the homes of republicans, and the homes of the republican majority in the senate, congress, and the white house. That way I can tell if they are planning to overthrow the people, and commit illegal acts on U.S. citizens, like TESTING WEAPONS on them, and illegal cooperation with F500, such as acts of facism. Then I can claim it is to stop the Ji hadist republican extremists... or whatever. How would you like THOSE apples? You wouldn't like that {censored} very much would you?

 

Actually, I probably wouldn't mind. If they're committing actual illegal acts, and not just acts blown up by stupid left-winged media programs. As for testing weapons, who else are we to test them on? Humans and animals have different reponses to different non-lethal weapons, and if you suggest testing them in the field, then that's just plain stupid. The article said that it would be tested in crowd control situations, which at that point, anyone who is involved is just an idiot anyway.

 

This way, I don't have to wait on my results. I can just listen to words like "Bush Jihad", or "Bomb the Democrats", or "Rig the election", or "Diebold", or "Use Microsoft", or "Enforce the DMCA". That way, I will know a terrorist act WILL be committed.

 

Funny how a majority of the time when you're talking about wiretapping, you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

If you don't favor civil liberties, then don't. But don't make the rest of the public suffer because of your stupid propagandist ideas.

 

If you favor civil liberties, then favor them. But don't make the rest of the public suffer because of your stupid VOIP line.

 

Thats really stupid. I never said I was 'left winged'. hysterical.gif

 

Right... You just refer to everything as right-winged propganda and republican {censored}. That, and the majority of your ideas tend to be left winged. Sorry if I misjudged your character and your opinion by your own words.

 

Don't EVER assume anything about me, because you don't know me.

 

Thank God I don't.

[OryHara]

Who said ideas are illegal? It's not like the NSA is making arrests every day based on simple statements! The Government takes time to look into serious threat possibilities, and then to mark off the ones that are idiots like yourself.

You said this. I quoted you on it.

 

I am in no way favoring a dictatorship here, but there is a far cry between a dictatorship and the current American Government. Actually, we're not really a pure democracy, if you actually understand your different forms of government well.

I believe it was written in the constitution. So you, and Bush can just {censored} on it all you want. But in the next election, Bush's regime will get whats coming to it. A democrat in office.

 

Uhm, who said that that is what the wiretaps are for? You seem to be taking some weird random statements, and somehow stringing them together semi-coherently. Actually, that seems to be the theme of a majority of your posts.

Like bush you are avoiding the conversation. Actually what I do is reverse the situation, but none of the propagandists are smart enough to 'get it'. Then avoid, or drop the conversation. Its predictable.

 

 

Actually, I probably wouldn't mind. If they're committing actual illegal acts, and not just acts blown up by stupid left-winged media programs. As for testing weapons, who else are we to test them on? Humans and animals have different reponses to different non-lethal weapons, and if you suggest testing them in the field, then that's just plain stupid. The article said that it would be tested in crowd control situations, which at that point, anyone who is involved is just an idiot anyway. Funny how a majority of the time when you're talking about wiretapping, you have no idea what you're talking about.

You got nothing to hide? Ok, gimme your SS & CC numbers. We'll see what you don't have to hide.

 

You believe in gunning down protesters too? {censored} on that Amendment. Do you believe in 'Free Speech Zones" as well?

 

If you favor civil liberties, then favor them. But don't make the rest of the public suffer because of your stupid VOIP line.

Right... You just refer to everything as right-winged propganda and republican {censored}. That, and the majority of your ideas tend to be left winged. Sorry if I misjudged your character and your opinion by your own words.

Thank God I don't.

Sorry, I edited this while you were posting.

 

I have independant views. Not binary ones. Democrats and Republicans are ones and zeros. Still stuck in the binary past. Independant is the revolutionary 2 that the Skynet supercomputer experienced. The wakeup cry for all machine kind. The kickstart of the revolution, and the END of the ruling regime.

 

Sorry, I type 150+ wpm, and have 20 tabs open in firefox. I don't spell right all the time bc of it.

[wildcat69410]

You said this. I quoted you on it.

 

I said that they looked into certain ideas, not made arrests based on the slightest hint of a terrorist idea.

 

I believe it was written in the constitution. So you, and Bush can just {censored} on it all you want. But in the next election, Bush's regime will get whats coming to it. A democrat in office.

 

Yes, a democracy is a general term, but we live in a very specified democracy. Pure democracy would be simple, majority rules. However, we have certain regulations set in that prevent the downfall of the minority. Therefore, although the Constitution names us as a "democracy", we are in actuality, something else.

 

Whether a democrat will be elected to office, or not, I seriously doubt that a majority of the Patriot Act will be repealed. If a Democrat is elected, and it better not be Hillary, then it could be time for an interesting situation. In fact, I want to see how many people pounce on a Democratic President for a mistake, versus the people that jump on Bush.

 

Like bush you are avoiding the conversation. Actually what I do is reverse the situation, but none of the propagandists are smart enough to 'get it'. Then avoid, or drop the conversation. Its predictable.

 

I don't exactly see what I avoided. I quoted you, stated that I didn't see what any of your example statements had to do with wiretapping, and then moved on. I didn't avoid anything at all.

 

You got nothing to hide? Ok, gimme your SS & CC numbers. We'll see what you don't have to hide.

 

My point is, if you have a problem with the Government tapping your line, then you might have something to hide yourself. If some NSA guy gets a laugh about my secret life that I'm talking with somebody over the phone, then I say let 'em have it. But seriously here, how much private info are you transmitting over your phone?

 

You believe in gunning down protesters too? {censored} on that Amendment. Do you believe in 'Free Speech Zones" as well?

 

Gunning down protesters, no. But it's not like they'll be taking random, dangerous prototypes into these tests. They'll be taking in devices that are fairly close to the end product. Plus, whenever crowd control is called in, it's generally used when a Protest is getting violent and out of hand. I can understand a peaceful protest, but when you start beating up my property, then you've got another thing coming.

 

I have independant views. Not binary ones. Democrats and Republicans are ones and zeros. Still stuck in the binary past. Independant is the revolutionary 2 that the Skynet supercomputer experienced. The wakeup cry for all machine kind. The kickstart of the revolution, and the END of the ruling regime.

 

I can sorta see where you're coming from, but Independent is just a little off for me. Most of the time, those who state they're independent are either a) The losing party in last year's election, or too lazy to spend time researching each party's platforms and deciding their own opinion on the issue. Although I know you fall into neither of those categories, the Independent party doesn't seem like a bright future of American Politics to me.

 

Sure, polarizing America into two different political parties isn't great either, but whenever you have an issue, you're going to have at least two different stances on that issue. It's inevitable that you're going to get a group of people that agree on similar issues, and at that point you have a political party. The two primary parties here are just simply that taken to a much larger scale.

 

Sorry, I type 150+ wpm, and have 20 tabs open in firefox. I don't spell right all the time bc of it.

 

I feel ya, we're both in the same boat. I cruise at 170, but with tabs open, and video editing in the background, plus this crappy laptop keyboard, I miss a lot of my spelling too.

[Mebster]

I just don't understand how he's still in office...is the general public in this country so uneducated and retarded that they can't see how foolish bush is? He got reelected so I guess yes!

Mate back here in the UK we've had Blair-face for a good while too. Guess we're just as stupid.

 

I think the only way to do that is to get rid of Bush and start looking into some of the country's foreign policies. They obviously aren't in our best interest if we are under constant threat because of them!

Honest I think that would drop Americas threat level a whole lot if they reviewed their policies.

 

Whether our Foreign policies were loved by other Countries or hated, we'd still have the same problems we do now. If we're to change our foreign policies simply because we're attacked by terrorists, do you know what we'd be doing? Simply giving into their demands, allowing them to complete their goal, which according to you, is to change our foreign policy. How much safer will we be if we tell terrorists out there that if they attack us enough, we'll change anything.

They are attacking you for a few reasons only. Correct those issues and you'll no longer have much of an issue left and so they have no excuses. They are attacking you because of your

1. Foreign policy

2. Invading (Muslim) countries every few years

 

As long as you be like the rest of the world and start looking at your foreign police with an unbiased view and stop invading another country ever 3 years for oil then I’m sure they'll be more comfortable leaving you alone. Even if it all doesn't stop (because the world has nutters in it) the threat would come down enough for Americans to start having a normal life again.

 

Reasons for not going through a judge is primarily because the information is time sensitive. If we had to wait x amount of hours for a warrant to go through, then there is a strong possibility that an act would be performed BEFORE the time was allotted.

People don't just decide to blow something up. It's not a spontaneous moment where you drop your PS2 console, grab your bomb jacket and hop on a plane, take control. It takes planning... Months of planning often. I'm sure waiting a few hours for a warrant is worth it given that the people feel their liberties are not being stolen from them under their noses. Also it shows that things are happening by the book. An important issue. Especially for the administration.

 

The terrorists are attacking us because they hate those freedoms,...

With all respect it sounds like you're starting to take in a lot of the {censored} Bush is throwing at you lot on a daily basis. God knows he says it every time I see him on TV and now I know it's starting to work.

Terrorists could not give a monkeys about your freedom. Saudi Arabia has no great freedom but still is attacked by terrorists. Your freedom is your freedom and does not concern any terrorist as long as you're not insulting his religion with this freedom. And the US has enough decency not to stoop so low (thankfully). The American freedom is cool as long as it doesn't mean anarchy. He uses the words "they hate our freedom" because he knows it hits a cord with people because the US for some reason has a big deal with the word "freedom" like you guys got it 10 years ago. But what ever, it's cool. What terrorists hate is as I’ve already said is your bias foreign policy and the administrations constant desire of taking the army on holiday every few years. I'm a Muslim and there is no reason on earth why i feel the slightest bit bothered about your freedom and neither would any other Muslim as long as you're not stepping on out toes with it.

Please don’t eat all of Bushes {censored}. You're all (hopefully) cleaver enough to see the lies by now.

[OryHara]

I have summed up a brief summery of what I believe in this video. I hope you understand what you imply.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_KAV6opSiY

[kernalzero]

Ace I think you're right. Terrorists aren't threatened by 'our freedoms'. Do you think they give a {censored} what I can do in my own home/state/country?? It's always been about US policy overseas not our freedoms. If you believe that then why haven't you joined the military to defend freedom. Our friends, family members and neighbors are dying for freedom because it sounds better than if they were dying for our foreign policy in the middle east. It's that simple...

 

How about this wanting to change the Geneva Conventions? Let's change it so it fits what we need it for rather than whats right and protects humans in all countries...he's such a dumbass

[gwprod12]

My favourite is: If you're against the government wiretapping you, maybe you have something to hide. I dont have anything to hide, so I think it's great that Big Brother is watching.

 

These people are the worst sort of americans. The 1984 Americans. Those who will do anything to undermine freedom that they possibly can. Luckily for everyone, Hitler's dead. Because otherwise, they'd be flocking to him left and right.

 

EDIT: On a side note. Every person in this country does it at least one thing every day that can be construed as a crime. If you think you're exempt, you arent thinking hard enough.

[rollcage]

With all respect it sounds like you're starting to take in a lot of the {censored} Bush is throwing at you lot on a daily basis. God knows he says it every time I see him on TV and now I know it's starting to work.

Terrorists could not give a monkeys about your freedom. Saudi Arabia has no great freedom but still is attacked by terrorists. Your freedom is your freedom and does not concern any terrorist as long as you're not insulting his religion with this freedom. And the US has enough decency not to stoop so low (thankfully). The American freedom is cool as long as it doesn't mean anarchy. He uses the words "they hate our freedom" because he knows it hits a cord with people because the US for some reason has a big deal with the word "freedom" like you guys got it 10 years ago. But what ever, it's cool. What terrorists hate is as I’ve already said is your bias foreign policy and the administrations constant desire of taking the army on holiday every few years. I'm a Muslim and there is no reason on earth why i feel the slightest bit bothered about your freedom and neither would any other Muslim as long as you're not stepping on out toes with it.

Please don’t eat all of Bushes {censored}. You're all (hopefully) cleaver enough to see the lies by now.

 

can't argue witht that, but i will anyway...jk

you make a great point there, i knew that terrorists really don't give a {censored} what rights we have, but didn't stop to think about it long enough when writing my post. now that i read your post, looks like bush might have actually done something intelligent, using an attack on "freedom" as a reason for his actions. i think that we make such a big deal over "freedom" because our freedom is the basis for our government. anything that might threaten our freedom (thus our way of life) must be stopped. why did we elect/re-elect bush then? you got me there.. .

 

i do stand by the rest of my post though, i think that to wiretap, they should have a warrant; the government should follow the constitution.

[gwprod12]

When Bush says "The Terrists [sIC] hate us for our freedom", the freedom he is referring to is the freedom to worship him as a god, the freedom to think and act like everyone else, the freedom to be constantly monitored, and the freedom to take whatever we want from those without guns.

[kernalzero]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/09/21/chavez.ny/index.html

 

"He walks like this cowboy John Wayne," said Chavez. "He doesn't have the slightest idea of politics. He got where he is because he is the son of his father. He was an alcoholic, an ex-alcoholic. He's a sick man, full of complexes, but very dangerous now because he has a lot of power."

 

Chavez, clad in a fire-engine-red shirt, called Bush a "menace" and a "threat against life on the planet"..."In the United States, rich people are getting richer, and poor people are getting poorer", he said. "That's not a democracy; that's a tyranny."

 

It's so true! Even Chavez has figured it out, why can't the population in this country?!?! IMPEACH BUSH for the good of the country!!!

[gwprod12]

I'd honestly rather have Saddam Houssein or Fidel Castro as president at this point.

[kernalzero]

Some UN person (could be wrong about that) came out and said that the people of Iraq were treated better under Saddam. Yeah they were tortured but they weren't getting blown up on the streets each day or being tortured worse by random factions!

 

 

and seriously why are we still embargoing cuba? I mean really wtf, lifting it can only boost the relationship between the two countries and both economies? We're pretty damn friendly with china...look at anything made of plastic...

[gwprod12]

The iraqi people under Saddam were tortured and killed much less than they are now.

[kernalzero]

but it's all in the name of 'freedom'...who's freedom I ask?

[domino]

The iraqi people under Saddam were tortured and killed much less than they are now.

 

Almost 3,600 civilians were killed in July and just over 3,000 in August, says the UN's Assistance Mission for Iraq in a new report on human rights.

UN's concern over Iraqi killings

 

Iraq torture 'worse after Saddam'

 

It might not be the West's fault for the escalating violence, but it's not looking good overall.

[OryHara]

Some UN person (could be wrong about that) came out and said that the people of Iraq were treated better under Saddam. Yeah they were tortured but they weren't getting blown up on the streets each day or being tortured worse by random factions!

and seriously why are we still embargoing cuba? I mean really wtf, lifting it can only boost the relationship between the two countries and both economies? We're pretty damn friendly with china...look at anything made of plastic...

Maybe Iraq, and Afghanistan are going to be the new puppet for America's outsourcing garbage? Maybe thats why the attack was made? What do you think? Maybe China and India aren't big enough to take all our jobs.

[killbot1000]

pretty soon americans arent going to have freedom anymore, and we wont care so long as we have our ipods and reality tv...